I am automatically suspicious of anyone who’s a patriotic American. Either they’re ignorant of our country’s history and are idiots or they’re proud of it and are psychopaths.
Edit: I just realized I’m paraphrasing Patrick O’Brien:
But you know as well as I, patriotism is a word; and one that generally comes to mean either my country, right or wrong, which is infamous, or my country is always right, which is imbecile.
For me, the difference between nationalism and patriotism is that patriotism is about what a country could be. It’s a willingness to sacrifice some portion of one’s own prosperity to make a better country for all. That’s certainly not what right wingers call patriotism though.
You are in my book, assuming you’re ready to make sacrifices towards that potential future. I personally think nation states are a necessary step towards something that humanity is clearly not ready for in the future, but I think we could have come up with some far better implementations.
I upvoted, but I wanted to add a few thoughts. See, I understand what you’re saying in that US history has been littered with acts ranging from questionable to horrible the entire time. However as a Canadian some of my most treasured people, both personal acquaintances and public figures, are/were American. Even though I criticize policies US policies (a lot more recently), I still feel a kinship to Americans and I like a lot of you.
I think America has an accountability problem where a very few people in power are allowed to COMPLETELY misrepresent the positions of their constituents and make national/state decisions that outrage huge portions of the population (often for money’s sake). In the 20-odd years I’ve been an adult I’ve noticed this about the Iraq war, the 2008 financial crisis + wealth inequality in general, climate, health care, and now of course the situation in Gaza. There’s almost no meaningful consequences applied when leaders act against the wishes of the populace or even your own laws. At worst some are not elected again and have to live on whatever millions they could amass during their years in power. Some say Americans get the government they deserve, but checks and balances don’t work if the few people empowered to check and balance are on the same corrupt/unethical page.
So I’m equally suspicious of anyone who thinks that America has, as a nation, been the greatest country in the world the entire time. I would simultaneously argue though that the US is home to some of the greatest people and that a large % of the population is at least as “good” as most other countries. Of course there are genuine shitheads in America, but that’s universal to every nation IMO. The real problem in my eyes is that your leaders have not been forced to actually put the “representation” in representative democracy. If you read all that, thanks for giving me your time.
The dirty little secret of US History: America has had moments of greatness, but America has never been great. You can’t pick a single era of America’s past and not find some group being oppressed or some inequality being perpetrated by the wealthy.
Can you with any significant population? I think that’s more human nature than American Exceptional(-ly bad)ism. In fact, if you look back though history of people assigned the moniker “The Great”, the vast majority of them were right bastards.
Greatness is unfortunately often paired with awfulness.
I feel like the left need to reclaim patriotism. It’s hard to get the average voter excited for your policies when you’re constantly shitting all over their home. That’s why I hang my big American flag in my window, with my trans and pride flags in the others. Fuck you rednecks, come and take it.
Same goes for business. If you see a bank called “Reliable Credit” you know they’re going to specialize in super high interest loans. “Honest Car Sales” is going to sell you a car that breaks down before you even get home.
A lot of bills in congress seem to be labeled like this too. Anything with “freedom” in the name is going to be some authoritarian bullshit.
I am automatically suspicious of anyone who’s a patriotic American. Either they’re ignorant of our country’s history and are idiots or they’re proud of it and are psychopaths.
Edit: I just realized I’m paraphrasing Patrick O’Brien:
For me, the difference between nationalism and patriotism is that patriotism is about what a country could be. It’s a willingness to sacrifice some portion of one’s own prosperity to make a better country for all. That’s certainly not what right wingers call patriotism though.
It sort of is - so long as what gets sacrificed is someone else’s and not their own:-P.
“Wear a mask? Nope, I’m a patriot!”
“Let you wear a mask, bc you “need” it to help you live? No way, bc you need to be more patriotic!”
“Patriotic” is a magic wizard-word that means “do as I say… or else”.
I guess I’m a patriot because I like to imagine that a country could be not existing. Nation-states were a bad idea.
You are in my book, assuming you’re ready to make sacrifices towards that potential future. I personally think nation states are a necessary step towards something that humanity is clearly not ready for in the future, but I think we could have come up with some far better implementations.
I upvoted, but I wanted to add a few thoughts. See, I understand what you’re saying in that US history has been littered with acts ranging from questionable to horrible the entire time. However as a Canadian some of my most treasured people, both personal acquaintances and public figures, are/were American. Even though I criticize policies US policies (a lot more recently), I still feel a kinship to Americans and I like a lot of you.
I think America has an accountability problem where a very few people in power are allowed to COMPLETELY misrepresent the positions of their constituents and make national/state decisions that outrage huge portions of the population (often for money’s sake). In the 20-odd years I’ve been an adult I’ve noticed this about the Iraq war, the 2008 financial crisis + wealth inequality in general, climate, health care, and now of course the situation in Gaza. There’s almost no meaningful consequences applied when leaders act against the wishes of the populace or even your own laws. At worst some are not elected again and have to live on whatever millions they could amass during their years in power. Some say Americans get the government they deserve, but checks and balances don’t work if the few people empowered to check and balance are on the same corrupt/unethical page.
So I’m equally suspicious of anyone who thinks that America has, as a nation, been the greatest country in the world the entire time. I would simultaneously argue though that the US is home to some of the greatest people and that a large % of the population is at least as “good” as most other countries. Of course there are genuine shitheads in America, but that’s universal to every nation IMO. The real problem in my eyes is that your leaders have not been forced to actually put the “representation” in representative democracy. If you read all that, thanks for giving me your time.
The dirty little secret of US History: America has had moments of greatness, but America has never been great. You can’t pick a single era of America’s past and not find some group being oppressed or some inequality being perpetrated by the wealthy.
Can you with any significant population? I think that’s more human nature than American Exceptional(-ly bad)ism. In fact, if you look back though history of people assigned the moniker “The Great”, the vast majority of them were right bastards.
Greatness is unfortunately often paired with awfulness.
I feel like the left need to reclaim patriotism. It’s hard to get the average voter excited for your policies when you’re constantly shitting all over their home. That’s why I hang my big American flag in my window, with my trans and pride flags in the others. Fuck you rednecks, come and take it.
Same goes for business. If you see a bank called “Reliable Credit” you know they’re going to specialize in super high interest loans. “Honest Car Sales” is going to sell you a car that breaks down before you even get home.
A lot of bills in congress seem to be labeled like this too. Anything with “freedom” in the name is going to be some authoritarian bullshit.