Ms. Soussana, 40, is the first Israeli to speak publicly about being sexually assaulted during captivity after the Hamas-led raid on southern Israel. In her interviews with The Times, conducted mostly in English, she provided extensive details of sexual and other violence she suffered during a 55-day ordeal.
Ms. Soussana’s personal account of her experience in captivity is consistent with what she told two doctors and a social worker less than 24 hours after she was freed on Nov. 30. Their reports about her account state the nature of the sexual act; The Times agreed not to disclose the specifics.
. . .
For months, Hamas and its supporters have denied that its members sexually abused people in captivity or during the Oct. 7 terrorist attack. This month, a United Nations report said that there was “clear and convincing information” that some hostages had suffered sexual violence and there were “reasonable grounds” to believe sexual violence occurred during the raid, while acknowledging the “challenges and limitations” of examining the issue.
Just joined Lemmy, holy shit this instance is full of nazis and genocide apologists what the fuck, tell me how many women do you think the IDF have raped over the last 75 years? Hell even just since oct 7?
Believe whatever you want in the privacy of your own mind, but this whole conflict wouldn’t be happening if some crazy religious people hadn’t stolen lots of land in the first place, and then persecuted the remaining inhabitants.
The “crazy religious people” and “who the land belongs to” switches around a lot depending on what year you pick as a baseline - you’re gonna have to be more specific.
Now, write an individual article for each child starved to death or bombed by Israel. I can’t muster the energy to care about a single rape in the middle of a genocide.
We have rape kits in Texas that have gone untested for over a decade. If rape was important to the people enacting justice, we have a long list to get through before we can start worrying about rapes in warzones.
But justice isn’t the intent behind articles like this. They want to justify the genocide with individual crimes.
That’s bullshit. There are many news articles literally every single day about the civilians killed in Gaza. Meanwhile, on Lemmy, you have people still denying that Hamas sexually tortured women captured on October 7. Sorry it doesn’t fit your narrative.
In my opinion, there is a huge difference between civilian collateral damage during a military operation and the use of rape as a weapon of war. We xan argue about how much force Israel is using and whether X amount of collateral damage is acceptable. But gratuitously raping people has no legitimate purpose, military or otherwise. It serves to sow terror and incite retaliation, which is why Hamas did it.
Neither rape nor civilian murder, or ‘collateral damage’ as you put it, is tolerable. But minimising the actual deaths and lifelong physical casualties, rather than just rape, of hundreds of people to just ‘collateral damage’ as though you would react in the exact same way if Hamas was bombing Israeli hospitals and schools, is [insert disparaging word here].
My point is that bombing a building that you believe contains soldiers sometimes also causes civilian deaths. We can debate whether sufficient care was taken, but the justification is that the army believes that enemy soldiers were present. Same with cutting off aid shipments. We can debate whether Israel has gone too far in restricting humanitarian aid, but the justification is that Israel doesn’t want supplies diverted for use by Hamas. What exactly is the justification for raping people?
Starving children is not a military operation.
You’re full of shit.
Nope. As I said in my other comment, cutting off aid to Gaza in order to starve out the militants hiding in the civilian population is a military operation that is at least plausibly justifiable. And I acknowledge the argument that Israel has taken it too far.
But what is your justification for raping people? What sort of military operation is that, exactly?
It is not justifiable at all! You don’t bomb a town because there’s a couple terrorists living there! Collective punishment is absolutely wrong.
Starving people to out militants is unconscionable. And, doesn’t exactly work either. Hamas has stockpiled supplies. The civilians haven’t. And if you kill all the civilians to find the militants, you’ve become just as much of a monster as the militants, if not even worse.
I guess the civilians could out the militants themselves, no? Then the IDF could take out the militants with fewer civilian casualties.
It’s easy to criticize from your armchair, but what is your solution to the ancient problem of militants who commit heinous acts and then hide among the civilian population? If you don’t have a realistic alternative, then complaining about civilian casualties is just virtue signaling. Lots of people on here have obviously never had to make a hard call to accomplish a mission. The IDF is using conventional military and siege tactics, while Hamas is using human shields and terrorist tactics. Civilians lose either way. That’s war. At the end of the day, however, I would rather see Israel win, not Hamas.
Also, when people say “but what about the children”, it sounds just as disingenuous as when conservatives say it. You should remember that Hamas and their ilk are not your friends, nor are they liberal or progressive or Marxist. They are brainwashed religious zealots who would happily torture and kill you if they could.
Well. This is pretty significant. I would say it’s rather damning evidence that considerably raises the bar to doubt these claims.
There’s a lot I could say here. Hamas is a bunch reprehensible fucks. It’s disappointing that we needed concrete evidence because of how untrustworthy the IDF is. But I think the most salient and important point here is that there is no “good guy” or “right side” among the war combatants. It’s awful people fighting awful people. Hamas and the IDF both deserve nothing but contempt and scorn, and both should be dismantled for their crimes against humanity.
I’ve tried to be very precise with my wording because none of what I just said applies to the Palestinian nor Israeli people. The civilians and innocent people are caught between two legions of hell and are the ones paying the price. The kidnapped and tortured Israelis, the Palestinian people – both of them are suffering at the hands of both Hamas and the Israeli government.
Neither of them care about the civilians. They use them as lambs for sacrifice and control the flow of information to manufacture hate and support for the war. It’s become readily apparent that the IDF and Hamas just want to keep fighting, and they’re manipulating the civilians to support them. If both peoples were getting the true, unfiltered information – sights of dying Palestinian children, demolished buildings, accounts of Israeli hostages – I think they’d be appalled at what “their side” is doing.
I really hope the majority would be appalled, because there can’t be any peace until they recognize their shared suffering and humanity. And to be clear, the majority of suffering is clearly inflicted on the Palestinians.
Edit: I’m not angry at the downvotes but damn am I disappointed. You’d think “fuck the people genociding others and fuck the people taking hostages” would be an uncontroversial position, but here we are.
Well the problem is one is the occupier and the one is the occupied. And people talk as if Hamas is the Palestinians problem and that it all started October 7th.
Treat people and respect them as humans, don’t put them in open-air prisons, and divide people into an apartheid system, then maybe you won’t have any terrorist attacks and/or rapes.
i noticed most lemmey users here exhibit the same kind of behaviour before the exodus from reddit.
very left leaning and wouldn’t hesitate to employ cancel culture if facts don’t fit their narratives.
at least there are sane usera like yourself have clearly drawn the line that condemning hamas doesn’t equate condemning the palestinians.
evidence have shown,if you condemn hamas,somehow or rather that’s Israel’s fault and anyone who does it is dehumanising palestinans,never mind the fact that there were palestinians celebrating the death of innocents and giving out sweets to children.
never mind the fact that there were palestinians celebrating the death of innocents and giving out sweets to children.
This is incorrect. Hamas told people that a prison was liberated, and that’s why they were celebrating. They had no idea that Hamas had killed innocent people like that.
Think about it – where does information in Gaza come from? A lot of it is coming from Hamas itself. They’re going to make themselves look good and lie about what’s actually going on.
this is the first i am hearing if this.
mind sharing where you got that info from??
Yep, here you go.
It’s a really good article in general, it does a great job of highlighting the disconnect in communication and how Israel and Hamas are manipulating the news.
thank you!
NYT is such an serious outlet. They NEVER lied about things. They never lied about Gaddafi, Hussein, Assad, Putin, WMDs, war on terror, war on drugs, China, Venezuela, Nicarágua, México, Jamaica, Yugoslavia, Soviet Union, Julian Assange, Snowden. Never!
Okay I see what you mean but while I’d like them to be lying as much as the next person this one is pretty damning.
True. This time they are not doing war propaganda. Because they never do
So much for “believe victims”.
We also don’t call Nazis victims when they face retaliation for their crimes against humanity either.
We also generally don’t condone retaliation against civilians for the actions of the government. We didn’t punish all Germans for what the Nazis did. Let’s not punish civilians for what Israel’s doing.
Otherwise? You’re closer to those Nazis than not.
Civilians don’t typically hang out in occupied territory.
Yeah they do? It’s how governments and groups try to legitimize their occupation and claims. It’s how the USSR operated in Eastern Europe with Russification.
That does not make it acceptable to kill the civilians. Russian citizens in Crimea are not enemy combatants. They can be evicted if they won’t peacefully integrate with the rightful owning country, but they shouldn’t be raped or killed.
Note that this is very different from the Israeli settlers. They exist in a grey area because they are committing violence against the Palestinians there and generally being awful shitheads and active colonizers.
Yea, if an invading force is slaughtering people to conquer your home, they are no longer just civilians. They are active combatants.
Do you not see any distinction between the actual military forces invading and slaughtering your people versus civilians who are living nearby?
