It’s happened before. A lot of the allies in ww2 were nazi-curious before their country was invaded. They were getting fairly popular in the US especially, holding large rallies and captivating the hearts of several of our captains of industry. I won’t go into the details.
Some states will go down the path of fascism until they pass the point of no return, and the state that existed before is well and truly dead. When they’re done warring against their own minorities they’ll attempt to expand to neighboring states because they need to justify their own existence.
Some states will follow the path of fascism until they see their peers further down the path either trapped in the turmoils of war and genocide, or threatening war and genocide on themselves or their close allies, then they turn around out of fear of the new common enemy. Like a sailor trapped by a sirens call only snapping out of it when the sailor in front of them gets devoured.
These are still capitalist countries and thus the incentive for fascism still remains even if it gets delayed a bit.
The US is the largest, most dangerous military superpower the world has ever seen and it has shown time and time again that it’s willing to use that might to bully other nations into economic submission. No country is really safe if it decides to start going after them. The US hasn’t always won these wars, but even when it fails like in Vietnam or Korea, it does enough damage on the way out to cause massive destruction and suffering which has long lasting consequences. I seriously doubt the rest of the world is just gonna get to sit this one out and watch America self destruct.
For 1., also don’t forget that major labour movements spring up during and after WW2, it’s hard to say how much of a repeat that will be this time around, but the potential is there
And 2., I agree, I am concerned myself, especially with nukes these days
But on the other hand, economy, and reliance on globalized production chains, is so much more central to the core of a nation these days. It’s not possible to just produce everything locally anymore, not like it was during WW2, anyway. everything is too hyper specialized for that now
So there is the potential that, if the US really does something very stupid and gets a complete embargo from the rest of the west, they’re just going to get completely fucked (and so will the rest of the west, but you know). So the amount of damage they end up being able to do might end up being limited
Of course, China would benefit massively from this, as they do actually go heavy on self-sufficiency, and then there’s the risk of Russia exploiting this as well, but the silver lining is that the US simply might collapse before it manages to do some real damage
In the end, I think the future of how the world will look like will be up to China. I really really hope that they end up having a massive democratic movement for the sake of the world, but we’ll see. At least China so far still seems like a rational actor on the world stage, although still ruthless and self-serving, of course
The reaction to Brexit in the rest of the EU - where almost from one month to the next people’s support for the idea of leaving the EU crashed to less than half as much as shown in various polls at the time - gives me hope that what Trump is doing in America is actually crushing the chances of his ideology in the rest of the World.
This seems to already be happenning in Canada (we will know for sure once the result of their upcoming elections is out).
In summary, I think there is good reason to hope that the result in the rest of the World of the Fascist Far-Right taking over a high-profile country like the US will be either the crushing of the Far-Right or it very explicitly distancing itself from the kind of ideology espoused by Trump - in other words, that America, just like Britan with Brexit, is really and unwittingly taking one for the rest of us.
As a pretty terrified American, I actually take some comfort in this idea. Please learn from us. I just hope if things get that far here, that the rest of you will have some empathy for those of us who did not want this. So many comments from people in other countries are blaming every American for this. Seeing so many of those comments (mostly on Reddit) has been the second scariest part of all of this for me. I’m used to being hated in the abstract for being an American, but to think that if the fascists here get their way people like me have no hope of escape is too much to think about
If there’s any consolation, I personally support asylum for Americans escaping political persecution for my country, I just hope that our government will act quickly enough for it, and the right not getting in the way
I expect a lot of, especially queer, people trying to escape, and I really hope we get something in place before it’s too late
I still have the hope that people see the trainwreck the US is now and go “oh shit”, and try to avoid it
It’s happened before. A lot of the allies in ww2 were nazi-curious before their country was invaded. They were getting fairly popular in the US especially, holding large rallies and captivating the hearts of several of our captains of industry. I won’t go into the details.
Some states will go down the path of fascism until they pass the point of no return, and the state that existed before is well and truly dead. When they’re done warring against their own minorities they’ll attempt to expand to neighboring states because they need to justify their own existence.
Some states will follow the path of fascism until they see their peers further down the path either trapped in the turmoils of war and genocide, or threatening war and genocide on themselves or their close allies, then they turn around out of fear of the new common enemy. Like a sailor trapped by a sirens call only snapping out of it when the sailor in front of them gets devoured.
I have less hope for two reasons:
These are still capitalist countries and thus the incentive for fascism still remains even if it gets delayed a bit.
The US is the largest, most dangerous military superpower the world has ever seen and it has shown time and time again that it’s willing to use that might to bully other nations into economic submission. No country is really safe if it decides to start going after them. The US hasn’t always won these wars, but even when it fails like in Vietnam or Korea, it does enough damage on the way out to cause massive destruction and suffering which has long lasting consequences. I seriously doubt the rest of the world is just gonna get to sit this one out and watch America self destruct.
For 1., also don’t forget that major labour movements spring up during and after WW2, it’s hard to say how much of a repeat that will be this time around, but the potential is there
And 2., I agree, I am concerned myself, especially with nukes these days
But on the other hand, economy, and reliance on globalized production chains, is so much more central to the core of a nation these days. It’s not possible to just produce everything locally anymore, not like it was during WW2, anyway. everything is too hyper specialized for that now
So there is the potential that, if the US really does something very stupid and gets a complete embargo from the rest of the west, they’re just going to get completely fucked (and so will the rest of the west, but you know). So the amount of damage they end up being able to do might end up being limited
Of course, China would benefit massively from this, as they do actually go heavy on self-sufficiency, and then there’s the risk of Russia exploiting this as well, but the silver lining is that the US simply might collapse before it manages to do some real damage
In the end, I think the future of how the world will look like will be up to China. I really really hope that they end up having a massive democratic movement for the sake of the world, but we’ll see. At least China so far still seems like a rational actor on the world stage, although still ruthless and self-serving, of course
The reaction to Brexit in the rest of the EU - where almost from one month to the next people’s support for the idea of leaving the EU crashed to less than half as much as shown in various polls at the time - gives me hope that what Trump is doing in America is actually crushing the chances of his ideology in the rest of the World.
This seems to already be happenning in Canada (we will know for sure once the result of their upcoming elections is out).
In summary, I think there is good reason to hope that the result in the rest of the World of the Fascist Far-Right taking over a high-profile country like the US will be either the crushing of the Far-Right or it very explicitly distancing itself from the kind of ideology espoused by Trump - in other words, that America, just like Britan with Brexit, is really and unwittingly taking one for the rest of us.
As a pretty terrified American, I actually take some comfort in this idea. Please learn from us. I just hope if things get that far here, that the rest of you will have some empathy for those of us who did not want this. So many comments from people in other countries are blaming every American for this. Seeing so many of those comments (mostly on Reddit) has been the second scariest part of all of this for me. I’m used to being hated in the abstract for being an American, but to think that if the fascists here get their way people like me have no hope of escape is too much to think about
If there’s any consolation, I personally support asylum for Americans escaping political persecution for my country, I just hope that our government will act quickly enough for it, and the right not getting in the way
I expect a lot of, especially queer, people trying to escape, and I really hope we get something in place before it’s too late
Welcome to our world. I remember the hate I had to put up with, just for being Serbian. Finally, someone else understands.
Half the country is fighting to run towards the trainwreck…